These Traffic Ticket Myths Are Not True - The Podcast

"SteveLehto" (stevelehto)
03/03/2016 at 09:00 • Filed to: None

You got a ticket? A friend of a friend of mine tried this one trick and got his ticket thrown out! Here’s how it goes . . . Well, there are no tricks and most of the things you will hear are myths. Here are some of the traffic ticket myths I’ve heard over the years.

And, here’s the deal. I’ve !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! . The topic is a fun one because we’ve all heard the stories. Those, “This one will work every time!” stories which have never actually worked. Ever.

And the scene above is something I snapped while !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! the other day. I do not know if the driver of the car had actually done anything to merit being pulled over but I do know the cop gave me the evil eye for taking his picture. Will the ticket stick? Maybe, but none of the following myths will help her. The audio -

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And the video -

Follow me on Twitter: !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!!

Hear my podcast on iTunes: !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!!

Steve Lehto has been practicing law for 24 years, almost exclusively in consumer protection and !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! He wrote !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! and !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! .

This website may supply general information about the law but it is for informational purposes only. This does not create an attorney-client relationship and is not meant to constitute legal advice, so the good news is we’re not billing you by the hour for reading this. The bad news is that you shouldn’t act upon any of the information without consulting a qualified professional attorney who will, probably, bill you by the hour.

DISCUSSION (100)

wiffleballtony > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 09:41

Flashing your boobs doesn’t work! Unless you’re a woman.

Buzz Skyline > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 09:42

I have had a ticket dismissed (along with a batch of other folks that got tickets from the same cop) when the officer didn’t show up. Sure, there’s no guarantee, but it happens.

SirPoopyPants > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 09:43

The trick is to hire a lawyer, we’ll typically get you the least shitty penalty and will at least get you out of court quicker.

npc58501 > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 09:47

Where was that photo taken?

jimz > wiffleballtony
03/03/2016 at 09:47

Kinja'd!!!

RSA > SirPoopyPants
03/03/2016 at 09:48

That’s worked for me, on an out-of-state speeding ticket. It saved me from having to be present at court as well. This is just my experience, so it should be taken with a grain of—wait, what am I saying? This is the Internet: Doing this is guaranteed to work for everyone! :-)

(But it really did work for me.)

SteveLehto > wiffleballtony
03/03/2016 at 09:50

And that will sometimes offend the lady-cops, too.

Miznitic > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 09:50

Why can’t you have a written article? I read a lot quicker than anyone talks.

SteveLehto > Buzz Skyline
03/03/2016 at 09:51

It CAN happen. But usually when a court has a specific rule on it OR the judge gets pissed about the no-show. In your case, the fact that there were a bunch of you and the cop didn’t show - that should have upset a bunch of people (including the judge).

Thanks for the note.

SteveLehto > SirPoopyPants
03/03/2016 at 09:51

Yes, and that is NOT a myth!

MechE31 > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 09:51

While myth #1 about the ticket being thrown out if the cop doesn’t show up may not be 100% and may heavily depend on location, but I’ve had 4 speeding tickets thrown out by the cop not showing up. One was a ticket where the speed was measured by aircraft. The cop that wrote the ticket showed up, but the cop that measured the speed in the air didn’t and it was thrown out. I’ve never had one adjourned on the cop’s account.

Note that all of these were without representation by a lawyer in Florida. All were heard by a magistrate and not a judge.

SteveLehto > npc58501
03/03/2016 at 09:52

Typical roadside, Anytown, USA. (Michigan)

thesalad > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 09:52

lol @ not signing tickets,
what I’m aware of is that All it usually means is that you are going to show up and appear in court on the date, or pay the fine.. if you don’t sign then you get to go to jail

SteveLehto > Miznitic
03/03/2016 at 09:52

I do:

http://thegarage.jalopnik.com/five-myths-abo…

therealdealjohnnyscarecrow > Buzz Skyline
03/03/2016 at 09:53

That certainly does happen, quite often, but as Steve said, it is no guarantee.

I’ve seen some courts dismiss immediately, some courts tell the person to sit down and wait and then dont dismiss until the morning recess, some courts call the local police stations, some courts have the officers from other departments attempt to contact the officer, and other courts simply postpone.

if your idea to “get out of the ticket” is to go and hope the cop doesn’t show up, and he does, you will only end up annoying the judge. If you do go to challenge a ticket, you better have a story and some solid reasoning behind your position, because all that is likely to happen is your ticket will be upheld and you will have to pay additional court costs.

SteveLehto > MechE31
03/03/2016 at 09:54

The airplane one is always worth a shot (since you can double your odds of them not showing) but I HAVE seen them adjourned for the cop. If you are not an attorney, I suspect your sample size (the number of tickets you’ve dealt with) is a little smaller than mine.

I’ve personally handled over a 1,000 tickets (and many of them were not mine!)

The-Guy-They-Warned-You-About > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 09:56

Best trick to get out of every ticket?

Don’t be the fastest thing on the road.

TheCraigy > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 09:56

I wish this counted as CLE, I’d get half my credits from you alone :D

damnthisburnershitsux > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 09:57

when I was 17 and had a fresh license I was able to plead down a speeding ticket gotten out in the middle of nowhere western NY, 3 hours drive from my home, entirely via the mail, I wrote a nice letter to the court and was sent back a plea deal to plead guilty to non moving disobeying a traffic safety device charge, this was back in 1989

npc58501 > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 09:57

It looked like an unmarked Southfield cruiser.

Rusty_Jaguar > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 09:57

I was in an accident, late night in Broward County, FL in 1993. I was crossing a bridge over the Intracoastal, late at night, and I rear-ended a car that was stopped in the middle lane after rear-ending another car. Had Maryland plates and 5 young adults in the car. The cop shined his flashlight in my face right as I came over the crest of the bridge and I couldn’t see.

I was ticketed for “failure to use due care”. I went to court to argue the ticket and the officer did not show up. The judge asked where he was and was told he was at North County Satellite testifying in another case. Case dismissed, I never heard another word about it. Just my 2 cents.

EveryCarIBuyIsDiscontinued > jimz
03/03/2016 at 09:58

I get the one straight cop in Rhode Island!

SteveLehto > The-Guy-They-Warned-You-About
03/03/2016 at 09:58

And when you get pulled over: Don’t be a jack ass.

SteveLehto > npc58501
03/03/2016 at 09:59

No, it’s not unmarked either. You just can’t see the department info due to the angle.

jimz > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:00

I probably brought this up before, but going back to one of your other pieces- I got a ticket about 4 years ago in Warren (turned left against a “No Left Turn 3-6 p.m. sign) and they offer a “civil infraction conference.” Apparently they’ve decided to do an “express informal hearing” where you go to the court house, stand around for about 45 minutes, then they call people in in groups of 4-6 and say “based on your driving record we are willing to reduce the citation to impeding traffic, $150, no points, please pay on your way out.”

off topic: ever argued in front of “Scary Mary?” or does she typically not hear civil cases?

SteveLehto > Rusty_Jaguar
03/03/2016 at 10:00

It CAN happen. Just no guarantees.

Garrett Davis > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:00

Here’s a myth I’d like to see answered. Do the courts really throw out the tickets? As in physically crumple them up and toss them away? Seems awfully dramatic if so...

These are the questions we should be asking.

wiffleballtony > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:01

There’s just no easy way out these days. :(

SteveLehto > jimz
03/03/2016 at 10:01

In Macomb? Yes, she hears civil cases too. I have not been in front of her in quite a while (and she’s not scary during civil litigation).

jimz > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:01

oh, have you ever been contacted by someone outside of the US (from the cities you occasionally call out at the end of your podcasts) to say why they listen?

yitznewton > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:01

What’s the best attitude to take when pulled over? I’ve been pulled over once, 15 years ago at the age of 20... I just put my tail between my legs. It was my coworker’s car which I borrowed, so I was just mortified and wanted it to be over. 41 in a 25 through a deserted college town during summer break at 11:30 at night :eyeroll:

dave1827 > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:01

I tried ignoring a ticket when I was 19. We were driving across South Dakota and an officer pulled me over for 4MPH over in a 75 zone. We got back to NY state and I figured I was off free. A couple months later my parents got a letter (I was away at college and their house was my permanent address) from the NY State Troopers stating that if the ticket wasn’t paid within 30 days my license would be suspended. I paid that one pretty quickly.

SteveLehto > jimz
03/03/2016 at 10:02

No. I am really curious about some of the oddball places but those could be ex-pats who just want to hear someone speaking American.

BigBlock440 > The-Guy-They-Warned-You-About
03/03/2016 at 10:02

Also not fool-proof. I know multiple people that got pulled over (including myself) even when the car in front was going faster.

DMCVegas > Buzz Skyline
03/03/2016 at 10:03

I had an officer no-show for a ticket as well. That didn’t matter one iota to the judge at all.

Having said that however... The officer had documented the traffic stop and took note that I was polite, cooperative, and respectful the entire time. As a result the judge thanked me for that, and dismissed my entire ticket outright.

The road isn’t the place to argue. Save that for the courtroom. Also keeping your cool can really pay off in the end. Plus showing respect for the court doesn’t hurt either. Dress appropriately, show up early and follow the clerk’s instructions for roll call and the like.

SteveLehto > yitznewton
03/03/2016 at 10:03

Be as polite and cooperative as possible. And that is based on 24 years of research.

SteveLehto > dave1827
03/03/2016 at 10:04

One thing I am curious about is I know people who have gotten tickets in Canada that they have ignored. I mean, A person could swear off ever going there again. But could bad things still happen?

Margin Of Error > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:04

If you are a prominent Jalopnik commenter and happen to own a Lotus Esprit, you can use your prestige to easily talk your way out of a ticket, and get your story published on the front page.

Kinja'd!!!

DMCVegas > wiffleballtony
03/03/2016 at 10:07

You know how I know you’ve never see The Cannonball Run ?

Kinja'd!!!

jimz > yitznewton
03/03/2016 at 10:07

just be polite/professional. the last ticket I got (prohibited left turn) went really fast, we greeted each other courteously, he stated flatly “There’s no left turn here from 3-6 on weekdays,” I responded that I understood, he wrote me up, pointed out my options for dealing with it on the envelope, and we parted ways. Don’t argue, don’t be a jerk, and don’t “play dumb” if it’s not going to do any good. In my case he had me dead-to-rights. The sign was right there, he was right there, I had just had my head up my ass and forgot it wasn’t the weekend.

Ojitheunseen > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:08

I mean, Canada has extradition treaties with the US, but I sincerely doubt they’d bother trying to process anything minor.

CalzoneGolem > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:09

This is helpful in every situation.

Foolio2 > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:09

I can attest to the not paying a ticket from out-of-state and getting a warrant put out for your arrest. I am from Indiana and on a business trip in 2002, I was in Phoenix Arizona and involved in a car accident for which I was the one at fault. I don’t remember ever being issued a ticket for failure to yield, but apparently I was issued such a ticket. Because I didn’t know I was issued this ticket, I never paid it and never showed up for court. Lo and behold, some months later, I got a letter in the mail specifying a warrant had been put out for my arrest for failure to appear and failure to pay a ticket from Maricopa County. I prompty called the clerks office, explained the situation, and paid the ticket. I knew I was at fault, I was just surprised because I knew nothing about being ticketed for it.

rhobere > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:09

If Drumpf gets elected, you'd have to move somewhere else. That's about the only bad thing I could think of.

Gizmo44 > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:09

Is there a download link to the podcast? I’d like to listen to this on my ride home today. Thanks!

MechE31 > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:10

I agree. My sample size is larger than it should be due to a stupid run in my youth where I would take every one to court and the fact that I would sit in on the previous hour of cases to get a feel for the judge, but nowhere near as large as yours. It is in a different locale though, and I have a feeling every jurisdiction has a different approach on this one.

In Florida, on petty offenses (the only ones that go to the magistrate), I have never seen or heard of an adjournment, but I have seen it happen personally with judges that handle higher offenses like reckless, 30+ over, accident with bodily harm, etc.

atfsgeoff > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:10

A mistake on a ticket, in and of itself, means nothing. But a mistake that calls into question the perception of the citing officer is far more potent. I had a ticket thrown out because the officer wrote down my car as a Mercury Sable when it was a Ford Crown Victoria. Can’t be reasonably expected to believe what an officer observed when he can’t get the make OR model of the car right.

unclespok > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:11

One word: fellatio. If the cop gets off you do too. If it’s a female officer a cunning linguist can usually talk their way out of it.

SteveLehto > rhobere
03/03/2016 at 10:11

Then it’s off to Mexico! (Where I will be promptly walled-out).

SteveLehto > Gizmo44
03/03/2016 at 10:12

It’s on itunes and soundcloud (and youtube).

JTSnooks > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:13

The only ticket I ever got out of (and I have had my fair share) was for 80 in a 45. I pled not guilty, and the bailiff took me and 3 other people back out of the courtroom and said our officer didn’t show up so our tickets were being dismissed. He got to mine and said “phew, you’re really lucky”, to which I replied “I know!” Talk about an answered prayer. A lot of them, actually, because I was pretty much begging for anything I could get that whole morning.

SteveLehto > atfsgeoff
03/03/2016 at 10:13

But that simply goes to credibility - as in, how much weight the court gives to the officer’s testimony. I’ve seen judges who’d believe anything said by a cop. “Up is down?” Sure, why not.

MechE31 > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:14

And from my personal experience, your attitude during the stop is the first thing the judge/magistrate will ask the cop about after he presents the facts. Nice guys got reduced plea’s, assholes got full fine (maybe more)+ points + court costs.

DancesWithRotors - Driving Insightfully > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:14

The way I’ve gotten out of all five of mine was... Show up to court. Show up to court. Show up to court...

The first one, I got lucky and the judge was in a good mood and dismissed it, due to my clean record.

The second one, I got “traffic school” and then the VCR was broken, so the class was dismissed after 10 minutes.

Third one? Showed up to court and the judge amended it to a non-moving violation because of my clean record.

The fourth one was pretty serious, so I called in a favor with a friend of mine who is a lawyer, and got him to show up to court with me. Dismissed.

And, the fifth one... After I moved to rural Kansas and got caught right where the limit drops from 55 to 30, one block from my then-house, I showed up to court, talked to the prosecutor and judge for a few minutes before court, shared a conversation about our mutual hatred of Sam Brownback and left with a clean driving record.

I’ve slowed down, in hopes I don’t get ticket #6 anytime soon.

SteveLehto > DancesWithRotors - Driving Insightfully
03/03/2016 at 10:16

It’s like a tractor pull, though: Each one gets a bit harder as you go along. Eventually, you’d run out of luck.

skeffles > BigBlock440
03/03/2016 at 10:17

Cop is told he is below average on the number of tickets dispensed, cop is having a bad week where he is all out of fucks to give, and decides he’ll take the low hanging fruit instead of the potentially worse offense simply because it is less work than getting into a high speed chase. He goes for the person who looks like he will pull over at 75mph rather than the guy at 99mph who looks like he will floor it.

ape_ck > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:17

Steve, good info. I have a question, I was in AZ for work and got 5 speeding tickets totalling roughly $2300 from speed cameras.

I called several lawyers in AZ and they all told me to ignore them because they were improperly served (via mail), what are you thoughts on this?

TahoeSTi > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:17

The only way to get out of it is to take to court. Once the cop has decided you’re getting a ticket there’s nothing you can do to stop it. Arguing with the cop is just going to make sure he writes down notes about you and then is more likely to show up to court. I’ve had judges ask me “was the cop being a Dick”, and i’ve also convinces DA’s to lower the ticket to a Parking ticket, this is something they can do in Nevada if you meet a certain criteria. Point is just be nice to the cop and if you want out of it deal with the courts.

atfsgeoff > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:17

Agreed, that’s my biggest problem with the court systems (at least at the local magistrate level). The officer is (almost) always given greater credibility than the accused. I’ve been excused from a jury pool during voir dire because I told the prosecutor point blank that I do not believe an officer’s word over that of a non officer.

catzo5 > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:18

I have friends up here thatllnever go back to the states because of drug charges. They dont ever expect to be extradited. So I doubt theyd extradite over a traffic ticket.

I know a lot of cops around where I live won’t bother pulling over a car with US plates because theyll never pay the ticket.

thom612 > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:18

In Minnesota if you have a relatively clean driving record you can pay a fee (usually twice the amount of the ticket) for “deferred prosecution”, which means that they agree to dismiss the charges after a year in exchange for your money. Never goes on your driving record or impacts your insurance, so basically pays for itself. It’s essentially state-sanctioned extortion, and in my experience, nobody really pretends otherwise.

beachfitrob.com > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:20

I would say if you want to get it dismissed, always go to court.

The officer may not show up. And if you are willing to question him about when his last training to use the radar gun was, ask to see the records for the gun calibration, etc. you might get it reduced or thrown out. These are reasonable questions so it’s not frivolous.

YMMV.

Basically kind of at least make them earn their money and be a bit of a pain. And if you feel strongly that it’s ridiculous (like 4 mph over someone said) then it’s a couple hours out of the day they’re not writing one for someone else.

Just think if EVERYONE went to court on them...

Example: we have a long stretch of road with few entrances on to it that is 40mph. The small municipality police love to write tickets there.

It’s a very poor town, but that road in about 4-5 miles at most goes into a neighborhood with multimillion dollar houses in it.

You do the math.

Another one: down that road there is a 45mph ramp onto a 60MPH highway. My friend got one for going above the 45 limit.

Who thinks it’s smart to merge onto a 60mph highway at 45?

BloodlessWeevil > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:25

If I recall correctly, states that want a signature on traffic tickets do not require it. The signature is (as Steve said) an acknowledgment that it was received by the motorist. These states allow motorists to acknowledge receipt with a signature instead of being arrested for the violation.

Austin Irwin > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:25

Great podcast Steve. I remember reading the Jalop/Gawk “just ajurn it a bunch of times” article. I always wondered how legit that was.

BigBlock440 > skeffles
03/03/2016 at 10:25

I figure it’s because the guy at 80 is closer than the guy that passed seconds before at 85. That way he can get back to his spot and sitting in a shorter amount of time. Or he wasn’t watching and just pulled over a fast moving car assuming it was the same one.

Bacon > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:27

I once got a ticket in rural Michigan, and in the process of moving, I forgot about it. Found the ticket 2 weeks after my court date, and called the court, expecting to have a warrant for not showing up. To my surprise, the clerk said it was dismissed. So, just don’t show up! haha, only kidding, I got lucky.

wiffleballtony > DMCVegas
03/03/2016 at 10:28

That was that 80s documentary right?

jimz > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:31

oh, my copy of your Daytona/Superbird book arrived yesterday. If I can break free I’m’a try coming by your book signing to say hi.

Oppenheimer > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:32

In my experience, you don’t really “beat” a ticket. You just hope to not get in trouble for what you’ve done.

My strategy is pretty simple. Be nice to the officer and hopefully he will write it for less than you were actually going. Go to court early, dress nicely, and be polite. Hopefully the prosecutor will dismiss. It’s worked for me every time I’ve tried.

Of course, if you want to go the attorney route, it’s less expensive than you might think. I friend of mine is a lawyer and will get a traffic ticket dismissed for $50 (this is speeding, not DUI or anything.) Given the hassle of going downtown, his time is cheaper than mine.

SteveLehto > ape_ck
03/03/2016 at 10:35

I have no idea. I’ve never dealt with such a ticket here. A local attorney should know but that seems dangerous.

The-Guy-They-Warned-You-About > BigBlock440
03/03/2016 at 10:40

Well maybe I’m just lucky. Never has happened since 1987.

Huffytoss > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:41

A lot of guys have gotten out of tickets by legally carrying a concealed weapon. Most cops just give you a verbal warning.

Rusty_Jaguar > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:41

Agreed. Plus....23 years ago. By the way, love your columns/videos.

SteveLehto > Huffytoss
03/03/2016 at 10:42

Why? Do they worry they will get shot if they issue the ticket?

200 Touring > atfsgeoff
03/03/2016 at 10:43

Dad had one get tossed because the cop dated the ticket wrong, and that was possibly after the day he went to court! Cop couldn’t figure out why Dad was all smiles and thanked him for the ticket until then, and Dad stayed the hell off that road in at least his company vehicle for a few months, to be safe too.

Volvo122 > Huffytoss
03/03/2016 at 10:44

What on earth does concealed carry have to do with a traffic ticket? Define “a lot of guys” too please.

BigBlock440 > The-Guy-They-Warned-You-About
03/03/2016 at 10:45

It’s a good strategy, but not fool-proof.

CalBearsFan99 > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:46

Perhaps they assume that someone who’s gone through the rigor of certification is someone who really appreciates the law, and is more inclined to not skirt it, but just made a mistake? I get my CCW next month, I’ll let you know if I get pulled over for anything and how it turns out.

No, they’re not afraid of being shot, I’m disappointed you stooped so low to the recent media craze.

EvilSuperMonkey > CalBearsFan99
03/03/2016 at 10:48

You missed the joke.

jimz > Volvo122
03/03/2016 at 10:48

“a lot of guys” usually means “the people I know who have said this,” and that’s usually “1 guy who heard it secondhand.”

it’s like how everyone knows someone who knows someone who swears they saw a birth certificate for a (usually black) child named “Shithead.” I’ve been hearing that one for YEARS.

ateamfan42 > MechE31
03/03/2016 at 10:48

Police will include in their notes the attitude of the person pulled over. When I once spoke with a DA about a ticket, she read right from the officers’ notes how I had been courteous (even though the cop’s initial attitude had been combative— I think he expected me to put up a fight). Being a jerk to a cop isn’t going to get you out of the ticket, and may cost you consideration later on the case as well.

drdude > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:48

No. In most states to get a CWP, you need to pass background checks and go to training classes. Most people with them are proven to be both law abiding, and willing to go the extra steps for proper safety training.
On top of that, if you are using your CWP at the time you are pulled some states (SC included) require you give your permit to the officer with your license and inform them.

I was released from rolling a stop sign with no ticket, and the reason told to me was because I was a CWP holder. Good guys really do get breaks sometimes.

SteveLehto > CalBearsFan99
03/03/2016 at 10:49

I was joking. I have heard this before but no one has EVER given me an explanation for it. What does having a CCW have to do with why you were speeding?

I have also never heard from anyone who has actually had this happen to them. I HAVE, however, heard of people who got in more trouble because they had their gun on them when they were DUI and so on.

Food for thought.

Huffytoss > Volvo122
03/03/2016 at 10:49

You have to inform the cop that you are carrying a concealed weapon during the traffic stop. Most cops treat you as the good guy if you are legally carrying since you have to go through the process to get the permit which includes going to the police station.

There are plenty of stories of people getting out of getting a ticket on the CCW forums. My coworker has gotten out of two speeding tickets recently.

drdude > ape_ck
03/03/2016 at 10:49

Any advice to “ignore” a legal threat is dangerous. I would find a differentt attorney. If they truly cannot stand in court, I would file a harassment charge if possible.

jimz > beachfitrob.com
03/03/2016 at 10:49

Basically kind of at least make them earn their money and be a bit of a pain.

remember this the next time you see something happen out on the road/in the world and say “why is there never a cop around when you need one?”

SteveLehto > drdude
03/03/2016 at 10:51

I am not so sure about “most” states. Michigan is a “shall issue” state. So long as you are not a convicted felon, you’re pretty much going to get one if you ask. So (here) that would mean that the cop could guess that you are not a convicted felon if you show him the permit.

CalBearsFan99 > EvilSuperMonkey
03/03/2016 at 10:53

It was never funny.

Markedly Zany Fop > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:55

I live in Houston, if I get pulled over I go to the clerk of court and request a trial by jury at least a week before my court date on the ticket, you can do this with a judge but is easier to do it before hand, then show up at the appointed time for the jury trial and watch the case get dismissed. This works great in my city and county because they only have 1 jury for about 100+ cases a day and the county/city attorney will rather go after the other more criminal misdemeanors instead of some stupid speeding ticket, also because i always do this my driving record in TX is pretty clean so they see that and I am good. This will backfire on me at some point and I will get stuck defending myself in front of a jury and will lose and have to pay the fine but hey until then I keep it up.

ateamfan42 > beachfitrob.com
03/03/2016 at 10:56

Who thinks it’s smart to merge onto a 60mph highway at 45?

Who ever said the law was smart? The law doesn’t care about physics.

QADude > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:56

I watched your video on YouTube yesterday - I knew a lot of the myths were already busted, but it’s nice to near a full explanation from an a lawyer who deals with this every day. Great job as usual!

drdude > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:56

Here its a shall issue state as well, but that does not mean there are not minimum requirements you have to meet.
Besides the obvious background check and fingerprinting, there is a training class minimum...
I think you would laugh if you saw the file that has to be sent for each person.. it includes a fullsize silhouette of the shots by the person.. makes for a very fat fullsize envelope.

jimz > thesalad
03/03/2016 at 10:57

some people have this idea that signing the ticket is a de facto admission of guilt which will then be used against you. AFAIK (Michigan doesn’t require you to sign a citation upon receipt) it’s only there as an acknowledgement that you’ve received the citation and understand the options listed on the back. or that if they don’t sign it, there’s no evidence they ever received it (it takes a really “special” mindset to believe that; Michigan traffic tickets are written on duplicate/transfer paper. You get the duplicate while the officer turns in the top copy with his original handwriting. They look like this:

Kinja'd!!!

SteveLehto > Markedly Zany Fop
03/03/2016 at 10:57

Do they dismiss it outright or ask for a deal first? I have demanded formal hearings on a pile of cases (for clients) for the same reason but they won’t dismiss them all - even though they could not do all the hearings. They just offer a bulk-plea deal.

CalBearsFan99 > SteveLehto
03/03/2016 at 10:57

Again to my point, it’s not causal, but it’s possible correlation that you’ve put in the effort to be “one of the good guys”, and maybe they’re more inclined to accept that you just made an honest mistake? Context is everything, I’m sure if you’re doing 120 in a 35, it isn’t going to help you....but a rolling California stop on a quiet street? Perhaps.

Agreed, a blanket statement that it always gets you preferential treatment isn’t correct.

PS, I know you’re joking, but the circlejerk around shootings and cops is obnoxious as of late :)

SteveLehto > QADude
03/03/2016 at 10:57

Thanks!

ateamfan42 > Foolio2
03/03/2016 at 10:58

I wonder if a lawyer would have had any luck in your case helping you prove you had never actually received the ticket? If in fact the ticket had not been properly issued (and evidence backs that up), would that be any grounds for being dismissed?

SteveLehto > drdude
03/03/2016 at 10:59

This sounds to me a lot like the one we used to hear all the time that - if you are an organ donor, the cops are less likely to write you a ticket.

I mean, It’s possible but the nexus appears to be so thin that I don’t know if it is really something people could count on.

ateamfan42 > Oppenheimer
03/03/2016 at 11:00

Be nice to the officer and hopefully he will write it for less than you were actually going. Go to court early, dress nicely, and be polite. Hopefully the prosecutor will dismiss.

My very limited experience with talking to the prosecution was that since the officer gave me a “break” (written for lower speed), then the prosecution didn’t need to offer me anything else. So they may see the dimissal option as giving you too much!

Xkjacob > CalBearsFan99
03/03/2016 at 11:00

“Rigor of certification”

Takes under 10 hours (For Texas)

I don’t think we ever had anyone fail, who passed the background check.

My former coworker, his wife(who is terrified of guns) and his elderly mother (80+ years old) all got theirs on the anniversary of his father’s death.

When someone tells me they have their CHL I am glad, but at the same time am pretty well aware we require the most bare minimum of knowledge.

My motorcycle cert and auto licence are more difficult to acquire.

I used to teach self defense and worked with some guys who did certs and sales. I’d get kick backs for signing people up or getting them to fill that holster :P.

I was worried some people I’d refer, who couldn’t escape a chokehold to save their life would bomb it and it would crater their confidence, but no one ever failed To get their CHL.